Hemingway:
Perhaps this is nothing but the pantster vs. (sort of) plotter approach, but I think it goes deeper than that. What do you think? How do you do it? Do you start your writing day by "recapping" what you did the day before, or start fresh and unencumbered? Do you revise as you work, or leave it all for the end? What works best for you?
I go over the last chapter I wrote and make adjustments--can't help myself. Perhaps I'm a control freak. The way we write could stem from our basic personality. Some people are haphazard in everythig they do, others are methodical and neat. I'm the latter. I like the idea of finding a rhythm in the writing though.
ReplyDeleteHaha--I totally get what you mean, Francene. I think it does help in maintaining a certain tone, a unity, throughout the book. And isn't that what rhythm is, in the end?
DeleteI usually follow Stienbeck unless I've been away from a story for awhile. Then I need a refresher to get my mind churning again.
ReplyDeleteGwen, thanks for stopping by and sharing your thoughts! I agree--a refresher is essential to keep the "voice" uniform, and also to sort of catch on to where you meant the story to go after you've been away from it for some time. Lately I've found I, like you, follow Steinbeck much more than Hemingway. Then again, I'm a pantster--totally disorganized, a wild child :D
DeleteI had previously encountered that advice from Steinbeck, having read quite a bit by and about him because he's one of my very favorite writers.
ReplyDeleteThe Hemingway advice was new to me, and not surprising since, although I have read a fair amount of his stuffs too, I consider him one of the most overrated writers of all time.
Although my personality is more in line with what Hemingway said (I'm very much the detail-focused analytical type), when it comes to writing, I operated much more in the Steinbeck manner.
I haven't done any "serious" writing for a long time and don't intend to do any of it again, but when I was still "really" writing, my favorite part of it was when the "unplanned magic moments" occurred; when something would just materialize on the page, seemingly having come from nowhere.
Often the little bits of "magic" were the best moments in my storytelling, and I don't think they would have mysteriously manifested had I not been working quickly and just letting my mind sort of operate in a meditative state.
So, yes, not only do I greatly prefer Steinbeck to Hemingway as I writer, I also greatly prefer his METHOD for writing.
Interesting post, Guilie.
~ D-FensDogg
'Loyal American Underground'
Thanks for this, Stephen. I do enjoy Hemingway's work, but Steinbeck... Well, if I had to choose, let's just say there'd be no competition to speak of :D You're right about those bits of "magic"--they're one of the most rewarding aspects of writing, and like you (and like John) I think they're a product of a sort of stream-of-consciousness state that is usually only achieved by letting go of the plan and the goal. Brilliant, those.
DeleteHow come you're not writing anymore? If I may ask?
GUILIE ~
ReplyDeleteOn a couple of occasions, for me, the “magic” bit actually comprised the ENTIRE piece of writing. The best example I can think of is the time I sat down with a piece of paper and a pen and the desire to write a review for a product I liked.
Facing that blank page, all I knew was that it would be a POSITIVE review, and I knew what the title would be. So, I wrote the title on the page and then I just let the pen go – it was almost like ‘automatic writing’.
About fifteen minutes later, the review was completed and required little or no rewriting. I read what I had written and was stunned and amused that “that” could have manifested on the page from nothing but a title and an appreciation for the product.
In that rare case, it wasn’t even a matter of a small bit of “magic” mysteriously coming to me, but an ENTIRE piece of writing magically, mysteriously coming to me.
Anyway... no, I don’t mind you asking why I’m not doing any “real” writing anymore. Here’s the answer:
I gave up the dream. After twice getting (relatively) close to success - with a screenplay and then a children’s book manuscript - and ultimately striking out both times, it took all of the hope out of me. I then concluded that I did not have the necessary writing talent and/or my writing was not “bad” enough to be successful in “this world” which, as The Bible states multiple times, is ruled by “the Prince of This World”, also known as satan. (Sorry you axed now, aren’t you?)
If you’re at all interested, you will find the story of my screenplay’s failure told here:
VENICE BEACH, CALIFORNIA: “The Townhouse Bar” (Or, “How Not To Sell Your Screenplay In Hollywood”)
When it came to my own writing career, I decided to take the advice of W.C. Fields who said, “If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Then quit. There's no point in being a damn fool about it.”
But my own failure as a “real” writer has not stopped me from dispensing writing tips to other Wannabe Writers (including the W.C. Fields advice). If interested, you can learn my writing tips by reading this: “METHOD WRITING”: How To Improve Your Writing And Get Thyself Published
Guilie, thanks for axing. (I’ll bet it’s a mistake you won’t make again.)
~ D-FensDogg
‘Loyal American Underground’
Haha--no, I'm definitely not sorry I asked :) I'm also not surprised you managed to sneak in a religious explanation, hehe :D Off to read the story of your screenplay, and I most certainly will add Method Writing to my blogroll. I am, however, sad you gave up the dream. I don't know many authors (actually, can't think of anyone else) who have done that, and I'm stuck between admiration and despondency. It takes courage to let go of the dream, to admit it's not going to happen, and to go on living afterwards--I know I'd have a really really hard time. On the other hand, your decision doesn't bode well for the rest of us. Isn't the primary bit of writerly advice to "Stick it out," "Learn the craft," "Make all the mistakes but learn from them and keep going"? The option to just quit and move on isn't something the writers I know entertain often, but your experience makes me wonder whether we--yes, I include myself--should.
DeleteAlways a pleasure, these conversations :)
GUILIE ~
ReplyDeleteWell, the last thing - truly, the LAST thing - I'd want to do is crush someone's spirit and quash their dream. But, as the bad song says, "You've got to know when to hold 'em'; know when to fold 'em". And for me, the time had come to fold 'em.
I had tried - sincerely tried - and I reached a point where I just could not absorb any more rejection and disappointment. Yes, I know that some writers have endured numerous decades of rejection and then suddenly acquired some measure of success. Not a huge measure of it but, anyway, they became published.
But for me, I decided that Mark Twain was correct about writing without pay for three years (I wrote for more than three), and if after three years no one has offered you pay for your writing, then sawing wood is what you were intended for.
I was gifted with better than average talent when it comes to acting, drawing, and writing, and as a result I did get kinda close to success a couple of times (with my acting and my writing). But I determined, when all was said and done, that as an artist I have only "Warning-Track Power". Warning-Track Power is a negative term that you're probably not familiar with (unless you're a big baseball fan), but you can Google it and find out what it means.
Anyway, I tried and I did achieve a very small measure of success (heck, I'm still receiving small residual checks for some small professional acting gigs I did back in the early 1980s), but I finally realized that I did not have the talent and/or the willingness to compromise my personal principles enough to make it big. So I moved on.
Ironically, today, I have an old manuscript about my drinking buddies in the early '80s - 'The League Of Soul Crusaders' - that I am CERTAIN I could rewrite and sell for a ton of money. It would, I am absolutely convinced, be made into a movie that would be hugely popular. Unfortunately, the problem is that I know this true story would inspire a lot of young guys to try to emulate the craziness that my friends and I were involved in back in the earliest years of MTV.
I would not want to be responsible for stupid young males drinking to excess and perhaps even dying trying to be like 'The League Of Soul Crusaders' were in the early '80s. We were very lucky to survive that stuffs we did. The next young man might not be so lucky.
So... I usually just try not to think about it anymore and trust that I'm meant to do something other than act or write ...or saw wood.
~ D-FensDogg
'Loyal American Underground'
My first draft was written in the second way -- reading what I wrote the day before and make obvious corrections, then continue. The reason was more to get back in the general mood. I thought it worked. When the draft was done and I read it top to bottom, I realized it didn't work beyond temporary mood helper. :D
ReplyDeleteIn draft number two (which I'm writing now), I (re-)write every scene with an eye on the original from draft #1 (if available), but completely rewrite it. And I don't correct anything as I go, I don't read what I wrote yesterday or last week. Because by now I totally know the story and the mood and whatnot, and I'm also aware the corrections I'd be tempted to make would be premature.
Funny how the learning curve for writing works, isn't it? Try it one way, learn from it, try something else, learn from that too, try again, and again, and again. I don't think the learning is ever truly over... Which, in a masochistic sort of way, is the reason I love writing so much :)
DeleteThanks for the visit, Vero!
Just goes to show we all need to do whatever it is that keeps us writing. I find myself doing a mixture of both. When I'm inspired and know where I'm heading, I move forward. If I'm uninspired or blocked, I pick a random section and just start editing. Even if it doesn't kick-start my muse, at least I made progress so it's all good in the end!
ReplyDeleteI think I am more of a Hemmingway girl - without knowing it. Geez, I'm 36 and not a girl. In any case, I tend to write, and revise as I go. Sometimes, my creativity gets the best of me and I forget my point, or what I meant to move towards. I'm definitely learning how this all works. Paying attention to the craft of it and being mindful of the mindslip. :)
ReplyDeleteI've quit writing dozens of times. Kept returning, I believe, because I've never gotten as close to success as Stephen. So I didn't have to get that bitter taste of "almost" out of my mouth. Recently had some success publishing genre (trashy) fiction for first time in 30 years as a writer. You never know.
ReplyDelete